The Catholic church in its formative years? From your perspective, in what ways are you different and in what ways are you alike? Did the Catholic Church start out on the right foot only to make a misstep somewhere along the line? Or was it corrupt and not following the teachings of Jesus from the very beginning? Is "corrupt" even a good way to put it?
Peace, and thank you in advance for your answers.
Update:For the record, I'm having such a hard time with this one that I am going to number each question and put a numbered slip of paper into a hat for each answer. Then I'm going to let someone in my family draw the number and that one gets Best Answer.
Personally, I see a number of parallels. But this question was not about what I think, it was about what you think.
Answers & Comments
Verified answer
This is an interesting thinking point for me.
Witnesses say their "Governing Body" is modeled after the first century Christian congregations, yet this model, even though they had seen Jesus, could perform miracles and had the disciples and apostles fell to apostasy within 70 years of it's inception.
So then I have to ask, with all that divine help couldn't save the congregation, what is different about the modern day Governing Body that makes it superior?
There are no miracles, no Jesus (cept the invisible 1914 one, lol), no disciples, no apostles, no prophets and no inspiration from God. But yet they are above questioning.
Why?
The answer I get is "Because these are the last days and Jehovah is working directly with them". I ask for any sort of proof that Jesus personally set up this Governing Body. The bible has exactly ZERO cases of where God appoints a human to act as his spokesperson and gives them no proof.
So you end up with a group of humans, that frequently misinterpret the scriptures, uttering false prophesies in God's name, patterned after a two thousand year old failed model and without any inspiration to their words.
Yet, this is the form of a lasting perfect godly organization?
I shake my head.
There is a vast difference between the Catholic church in its formative years?
The Catholic curch is not following Bible truths. I saw yesterday on the national news the pope is calling for "gays, lesbians, etc.; to come back to the church because the Catholic church would be
losing money, otherwise!
There are many differences and no similarites. For one - never will the Governing Body take upon themselves to instruct their members to go and fight and kill in the name of God.
Just one of many examples:
The first crusade against the Muslims were by the Roman Catholics church that the Pope at that time instructed a crusade to massacre all Muslims in Jerusalem for their destruction of their church. Men, women and children were killed and their township destroyed.
Huge misstep of misapplying the scriptures I would say. Remember Satan had instructed Jesus to hurl himself down and call angels for his rescue? The apostles had wondered why Jesus would not ask for help from the angels when he was being arrested? Why would Jesus not do this? Because #1 - we were never to put Jehovah to the test. #2 - the scriptures had to be fulfilled. Even Jesus would not take matters into his own hands. He knew the scriptures and knew Jehovah enough that he knew what future plans Jehovah had and there was no need to act in his behalf.
If the Catholic Church from the beginning knew God and the scriptures well enough, there would have been no crusades against anyone. “Do not avenge yourselves, beloved, but yield place to the wrath; for it is written: ‘Vengeance is mine; I will repay, says Jehovah.’” (Romans 12:19)
The Governing Body knows this scripture, Jesus teachings and Jehovah well enough that they know exactly which way Jehovah is headed. There is no need to act without his guidance and direction.
That is why Roman Catholic Churches will never get right with God.
Greetings,
The Catholic Church was never Christian; it was corrupt from it’s very beginning especially when it aligned itself with Rome in the third century. However, its roots can be traced directly to the Apostasy which began in the first century (Ac. 20:29, 30; 1Cor.4:8; 2Cor.11:2-4; 3; 2Thes.1:6-8; 2Tim.4:3,4; 2:1-3, 6-10; 2Pt. 2:1, 3; 1Jn 2:18, 19 Jn1:9).
A PRIMARY difference and the basis for the differing beliefs between Witnesses and Catholics is because Catholics look to the Pope as the final authority while JWs believe that the Bible is the *final* authority on doctrinal belief and it cannot be overridden by any human or organization. JWs do not believe that any human is infallible.
The Governing Body itself has reproved Witnesses for even using terminology that would even appear to place the WTS as their authority on any subject, re-emphasizing that JW's should use only the Bible as their source.--(w98 3/15 p.18)
Catholics view the Pope as infallible in his interpretation of doctrines (or educated Catholics refer to the "magisterium" as infallible). Catholics look to the Pope/magisterium and "tradition" as the final authority on what the Bible "really" teaches and view the Bible as a secondary and untrustworthy source.
This is the greatest difference and is the reason that Catholics do not accept the clear teaching of the Bible and also why they were not officially allowed to read the Bible on their own until recent history.
On the other hand, Witnesses have no "clergy class" and their teachers are described with the Biblical terms "Elder," "Overseer," and "Minister." As the description implies these men are simply experienced counselors and shepherds. These Overseers are not "masters of our faith" but are given authority to keep the Christian Congregation clean of immoral and false doctrinal influences (Heb.13:17,24; 1 Thes. 5:12; 1Cor.16:16).
The Witnesses’ teaching is very clear:
"What GOD'S WORD has to say on any issue should be considered as final and binding on all members"--w68 2/1 p. 84
They direct attention to the BIBLE as:
"the FINAL AUTHORITY."--km 9/02 p.2; g80 9/22 p.12; it-1 p.1205; g75 10/22 p.22; g70 4/22 p.25
"The ABSOLUTE AUTHORITY." --sg p.155; w77 5/1 p.287; w56 11/15 p.704
"The SOLE AUTHORITY for all that they believe."--w85 5/15 p.30
"The ONLY SOURCE of truth."--g00 4/8 p.9
"The Watchtower does not claim to be inspired in its utterances, nor is it dogmatic. It invites careful and critical examination of its contents in the light of the Scriptures."–Wt 8/15/50
All our beliefs and teachings are derived from the Bible as the final authority (2Tim 3:16,17; Gal. 1:8, 9).
These quotes also show how we are sure that our beliefs are correct. From the first study with JWs a person is taught to examine the Bible and compare their personal beliefs. We do not just believe what is said but we do what the Bereans did; we "carefully check the Scriptures" to make sure what is said is Truth (Ac.17:11).
Through extensive study individual Jehovah's Witnesses have come to trust the accuracy of their beliefs. Through experience they have proven that all True Christians are associated with Jehovah's Witnesses and this organization is the only one which gives solid evidence of being God's congregation.
So, we do not blindly follow any organization but we recognize those who give evidence of accurate teaching. Witnesses give evidence that they are True Christians by their strictly following Scriptural truth and by their fruitage (Mat.7:16-19; Jn.13:34,35).
All Witnesses do is to invite others to do the same, critically examine your beliefs in light of the plain and explicit teaching of Scripture and the evidence in the actions of your religion and its members, then choose to follow Christ closely (Rom.10:1-3; Eph.1:17).
Yours,
BAR-ANERGES
EDIT:
Oh my! Walls, your comment is so illogical it hurt my head.
As usual, critics like Walls, must dishonestly rip quotes out of context. None of your quotes say we unquestioningly trust the GB or view it as the final authority. In fact, if you read the whole articles you would see that EVERY one does point to the Bible as the ONLY source of authority. And we listen to overseers ONLY because we see they are teaching in harmony with the Bible!
These articles simply teach EXACTLY what God Himself stated:
“The wisdom of this world is foolishness with God...“ (1Co 3:18-20; 1:19-30; Pr 3:7; 26:12; 28:26; Rm 12:16; Isa 5:21; Jer 10:23).
Btw, when you say "your organization", you automatically include the GB AND all the JWs in the whole world, yes including those on Y!A. The GB are as much Jehovah's Witnesses as the little local Witness girl who brings you your monthly magazines.
The Catholic Church's formative years were spent burying the truth (teaching lies, hiding the Bible from people by keeping it inaccessible and in dying languages), whereas the Witnesses' formative years were spent uncovering hidden truths and proclaiming them to others, putting the Word of God into people's hands through distribution of Bible and helping in translating it into as many languages as possible to allow the majority to read it for themselves.
Vot thinks the only similarity between the RCC and the JWs is that both claim to be Christian. After that, eish.....
There is absolutely no comparison. I was raised a catholic and left when I turned 14 and found Jehovah in my early 30's!
I guess the only way they are alike is that they both claim to be representatives of our Creator. But really that is the only one and the catholic faith have proved beyond doubt that they cannot possibly be the real thing since they go totally against our Creator.
Our society has never been corrupt. They have made errors and practises things that Jehovah disapproved of but on reading closer the scriptures, they made the necessary changes. Right from when our society started, they recognised the role that they needed to play if they wanted to follow in Jesus' footsteps and thus have continued to this day.
No the catholic faith have never been on the right foot. Their history is one of barbarism in the extreme.
We are the only faith that adhere completely to what our Creator says. There is only one Creator and thus only one way to worship Him and that is His way!
The First Century had an unpaid Elder body in each congregation, the central congregation was in Jerusalem and was made up of some of the apostles of JC. The primary purpose of the first Century Congregation was to preach.
By the fourth Century "Christianity" as foretold had become deeply apostate, when Constantine adopted a form of Christianity he formed the Catholic church.
The Governing Body of the modern day congregation is made up of unpaid Elders who have taken a vow of poverty.
They are not inspired, and use the bible as their authority.
You cannot untie the influence of 1600 years of false teachings overnight.
Did you know JWs used to celebrate Christmas, Easter, birthdays until they discovered the pagan origins of these celebrations.
The message found in gods word is what counts.
"Corrupt" is the only way to "put it".
The RCC, like all mystical shams, was invented to amass power and gain dominance.
In this case, of the Roman Empire.
Caribbean Man really summed up the historical record of jw development into it's modern day parallel to the Catholic Church.
Not much difference between the two organizations when it comes to confession of sins. Catholics are taught that they must enter a confessional booth, and tell the religious leader their sins. Jehovah Witnesses are taught that they must tell an elder their sin, who in turn will tell the body of elders who then appoint 3 elders to "hear the case".
Catholics have their sins adjudicated by a single man (priest/elder) and remedies assigned to the sinner. Jehovah's Witnesses seek forgiveness through 3 men, who apply remedies. What makes jw handling of sins different is they go beyond requiring prayer and suplication to God and actually pass severe punishments on the sinner.
These 3 men actually deciding if the sinner is sufficiently 'repentant' enough to remain in association with other jw. About 2% or more of the total 8 million or around 60-70,000 are disfellowshipped every year.
These sinners who did not cry enough, show enough repentance, or look down cast enough, are summarily removed from all family and friends. Many of them ending up in much a much more degraded state after such treatment.
Jw here condemn the Catholic church for it's past evil wars, inhuman treatment of their followers, but this one doctrine of disfellowshipping has caused millions of families to be torn apart and deep depressions, suicides, and all forms of degraded conduct, from those who feel that God no longer cares about them.
Yes in many ways jw religion is very similar to the Catholics.
They use governing bodies of Jesus' time and they have Jehovah's Holy Spirit,